NEVER AGAIN

Dino D

Zorg Guru (V)
British Zeds
Joined
Mar 28, 2014
Points
176
Location
Kent
Model of Z
2.8 Manual
Found it @Brian H , learn something new about these cars all the time. Cheers for the heads up. @Mnbrennan you better bring the beam down :)

View attachment 50614
Sorry for the OT here, maybe needs a thread if it's own.
Just wondering if the 2.8 subframe can be modified like the M one as a cost effective way to correct camber while the subframe is out @Lee @Brian H
 
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Dino D

Zorg Guru (V)
British Zeds
Joined
Mar 28, 2014
Points
176
Location
Kent
Model of Z
2.8 Manual
What you lot talking about?

The bolt is in the same place as last week, I'll get another chance on Saturday. In the meantime I've ordered:
  • H&R Anti Roll Bars
  • Stainless brake lines all round
  • Rear discs
  • Yellowstuff pads all round
  • Powerflex subframe bushes
  • Brakes are being returned
Need to buy
  • Front brake discs
  • Sills
  • A load of nuts bolts etc.
  • Brake plates
  • Exhaust mounts
I also had a delivery of some POR 15 to sort the chassis out

@Lee , need to sort out a time for my subframe...
I like your thinking, can't get a bolt out so go buy loads of other stuff to keep you busy!
 

Lee

Zorg Guru (V)
British Zeds
M Power
#ZedShed
Joined
Mar 26, 2014
Points
193
Location
Basingstoke
Model of Z
Z4 Coupe 3.0si
Sorry for the OT here, maybe needs a thread if it's own.
Just wondering if the 2.8 subframe can be modified like the M one as a cost effective way to correct camber while the subframe is out @Lee @Brian H
You can buy camber kits that do this. :)
 

Randy Forbes

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 30, 2017
Points
24
Randy Forbes truisms:

The Z3 suspension carrier is NOT the same as the M version. The M has an internal brace not present in the Z3. The Z3 version has different geometry for the inboard trailing arm mounts, increasing static negative camber (dramatically increased with lowering springs). Weld-in toe/camber kits can be biased on installation to remove the negative camber on Z3s.

The rear swaybar mounts, both the tabs on the trailing arms, and the mounts for the bar on the body, are prone to failure. I've found them completely detached even with the stock rear bar. There are commercially available brackets to weld onto the trailing arms (though fabricating your own is plenty easy too) and boxing in & securely welding the body mounts is a relatively easy task too.

So far, we have two (2) good reasons for getting that MIG welder on your wishlist__and DEFINITELY go with the shielding gas, NOT flux-core wire (which looks like birdpoop on it's best day...).

And for today's finale', the primary subject at hand; getting those #&*^#$@ bolts out! Okay, this is a foolproof trick__(secretly hoping that I didn't just jinx it...)__but it works for me time after time after time, particularly on the rusted/seized nuts/studs that secure the mid-pipe to the exhaust manifolds. It's going to take some heat, if you can get to a dull cherry, you'll achieve enough expansion/contraction to break the molecular bonds of rust. A MaPP Gas portable bottle/torch is adequate for this, and available at most any tool supplier or hardware store. Let it cool, and touch a small stub of candle to it. The heat will wick its way into the threads and help lubricate them. This can be repeated a couple of times. Ideally, while still hot, you can get a tool to hold the bolt, and begin to work it back and forth. If it stops turning, reheat, and touch more wax to it and try turning again.

Okay, that was Round 1 on the bolts, but that stood its best chance of working before the head got all b******* up!

For Round 2, roll up your sleeves and let's get 'er done! Cut your losses, and DRILL off the bolt-heads! You have the center of the Allen socket as a guide for the center, and drill progressively larger holes__USING ONLY SHARP, HIGH QUALITY DRILL BITS__untill you get to the tap-size for the M8 (I'd have to look it up, but maybe a 6.5mm) by which time the heads should've fallen off.

Get the suspension carrier out of the way, and then finish the reconnaissance work to restore the threaded holes in the body. IF there are still remnants of the bolts left in the holes, the WORLDS BEST EXTRACTORS are Left Hand drill bits! Ask any aeronautical technician or engineer (not to mention WISE auto techs). The heat from drilling, and the cutting-biting action is all but guaranteed to walk the stub out of the recess before you can ever drill all the way through.

ALL of these things that I've described, can be backed up with photo-documentation, ANYONE is more than welcome to peruse my gallery of work albums (like every car that I've worked on in the last twelve years has its own album, currently at 61,807 images).
 

oldcarman

Zorg Guru (V)
Supporter
Canadian Zeds
The M44 Massive
Joined
Feb 11, 2014
Points
188
Location
Pine Falls Manitoba can.
Model of Z
1.9 M44
Welcome @Randy Forbes from Canada! I sent a message to BMBabe yesterday advising the wax trick should be tried by @Mnbrennan. Nice to know someone with your qualifications uses this time worn remedy as well. Simple but usually works!! JIM
 

Mnbrennan

Zorg Guru (IV)
British Zeds
M Power
#ZedShed
Joined
Jul 25, 2015
Points
153
Location
Aylesbury
Model of Z
BMW M Coupe / 2.8 roadster
Randy Forbes truisms:

The Z3 suspension carrier is NOT the same as the M version. The M has an internal brace not present in the Z3. The Z3 version has different geometry for the inboard trailing arm mounts, increasing static negative camber (dramatically increased with lowering springs). Weld-in toe/camber kits can be biased on installation to remove the negative camber on Z3s.

The rear swaybar mounts, both the tabs on the trailing arms, and the mounts for the bar on the body, are prone to failure. I've found them completely detached even with the stock rear bar. There are commercially available brackets to weld onto the trailing arms (though fabricating your own is plenty easy too) and boxing in & securely welding the body mounts is a relatively easy task too.

So far, we have two (2) good reasons for getting that MIG welder on your wishlist__and DEFINITELY go with the shielding gas, NOT flux-core wire (which looks like birdpoop on it's best day...).

And for today's finale', the primary subject at hand; getting those #&*^#$@ bolts out! Okay, this is a foolproof trick__(secretly hoping that I didn't just jinx it...)__but it works for me time after time after time, particularly on the rusted/seized nuts/studs that secure the mid-pipe to the exhaust manifolds. It's going to take some heat, if you can get to a dull cherry, you'll achieve enough expansion/contraction to break the molecular bonds of rust. A MaPP Gas portable bottle/torch is adequate for this, and available at most any tool supplier or hardware store. Let it cool, and touch a small stub of candle to it. The heat will wick its way into the threads and help lubricate them. This can be repeated a couple of times. Ideally, while still hot, you can get a tool to hold the bolt, and begin to work it back and forth. If it stops turning, reheat, and touch more wax to it and try turning again.

Okay, that was Round 1 on the bolts, but that stood its best chance of working before the head got all b*****ed up!

For Round 2, roll up your sleeves and let's get 'er done! Cut your losses, and DRILL off the bolt-heads! You have the center of the Allen socket as a guide for the center, and drill progressively larger holes__USING ONLY SHARP, HIGH QUALITY DRILL BITS__untill you get to the tap-size for the M8 (I'd have to look it up, but maybe a 6.5mm) by which time the heads should've fallen off.

Get the suspension carrier out of the way, and then finish the reconnaissance work to restore the threaded holes in the body. IF there are still remnants of the bolts left in the holes, the WORLDS BEST EXTRACTORS are Left Hand drill bits! Ask any aeronautical technician or engineer (not to mention WISE auto techs). The heat from drilling, and the cutting-biting action is all but guaranteed to walk the stub out of the recess before you can ever drill all the way through.

ALL of these things that I've described, can be backed up with photo-documentation, ANYONE is more than welcome to peruse my gallery of work albums (like every car that I've worked on in the last twelve years has its own album, currently at 61,807 images).
Very comprehensive Randy, thank you.

Extra parts have been ordered today :)
 

Brian H

Zorg Expert (I)
Supporter
British Zeds
Scottish Zeds
Joined
Dec 5, 2011
Points
205
Location
Killin
Model of Z
E36/7 3.0i - E85 Z4///M
Just remember Martin, although your struggling with a difficult bolt, your not paying an hourly rate for someone else to struggle with it.
 

Mnbrennan

Zorg Guru (IV)
British Zeds
M Power
#ZedShed
Joined
Jul 25, 2015
Points
153
Location
Aylesbury
Model of Z
BMW M Coupe / 2.8 roadster
Just remember Martin, although your struggling with a difficult bolt, your not paying an hourly rate for someone else to struggle with it.
This is very true. I also like to get to know the car better. So far she's a stubborn git!
 

t-tony

Zorg Expert (II)
Supporter
British Zeds
#ZedShed
Joined
Dec 31, 2013
Points
226
Location
Torksey Lock,Lincoln, England
Model of Z
E89 Z4 23i Auto
Strange you should say "She's" etc. :bag:

Tony.
 

t-tony

Zorg Expert (II)
Supporter
British Zeds
#ZedShed
Joined
Dec 31, 2013
Points
226
Location
Torksey Lock,Lincoln, England
Model of Z
E89 Z4 23i Auto
Got that sticker on my toolbox Lee. So true ................................. ;)

Tony.
 

Brian H

Zorg Expert (I)
Supporter
British Zeds
Scottish Zeds
Joined
Dec 5, 2011
Points
205
Location
Killin
Model of Z
E36/7 3.0i - E85 Z4///M
You know how it goes "if its got tits or tyres its going to give you a headache" =))
I must live in the dark ages, first time I've heard this, made me chuckle:)
 

Mnbrennan

Zorg Guru (IV)
British Zeds
M Power
#ZedShed
Joined
Jul 25, 2015
Points
153
Location
Aylesbury
Model of Z
BMW M Coupe / 2.8 roadster
Round 2. Have followed Tony's suggestion of removing the big bolt. My stuck bolt is moving with the small cover, meaning it's not the threads that are the issue it's that the Allen head is stuck to the cover!
20170225_092514.jpg
 

Dino D

Zorg Guru (V)
British Zeds
Joined
Mar 28, 2014
Points
176
Location
Kent
Model of Z
2.8 Manual
No pressure mate but your £^*%cking rusty bolt is officially an International Z3 incident with input from local and global mechanical Z gurus!

The only thing left to try now is:
IMG_1446.JPG
 

Mnbrennan

Zorg Guru (IV)
British Zeds
M Power
#ZedShed
Joined
Jul 25, 2015
Points
153
Location
Aylesbury
Model of Z
BMW M Coupe / 2.8 roadster
No pressure mate but your £^*%cking rusty bolt is officially an International Z3 incident with input from local and global mechanical Z gurus!

The only thing left to try now is:
View attachment 50670
Lmao.

The f&>"(* is out!! Once moving it was fine!!!
 

Jack Ratt

Zorg Expert (I)
Supporter
British Zeds
The West Country
Joined
Dec 3, 2013
Points
200
Location
TRURO, CORNWALL
Model of Z
2.8i AUTO and 2.8i MANUAL
No pressure mate but your £^*%cking rusty bolt is officially an International Z3 incident with input from local and global mechanical Z gurus!

The only thing left to try now is:
View attachment 50670
I used this technique to remove a tree from my front garden at my first house way back in early 1980's.
At the time I had a Volvo 244. I wrapped a rope around the tree and put the other end onto my tow bar.
I gave her plenty of welly and pulled the tree out easily, along with half the pavement that came out with the tree roots.
A week or so later a gang of pikey's came round asking if I wanted my drive re tarmacked. They didn't do my drive but I got them to repair the footpath for £20 =))
 
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